New Telegraph

Nigerians shouldn’t play politics with security issues – Sule

Abdullahi Sule is the governor of Nasarawa State. In this interview monitored on Channels Television, he speaks on rising insecurity in the country, what President Muhammadu Buhari is doing to tackle it and why the Federal Government should seek foreign assistance, among others. ANAYO EZUGWU reports

What is your view on the statement coming from the office of the National Security Adviser (NSA) that decisive action to end assaults by bandits and Boko Haram insurgents in the country?

Let me first and foremost join good Nigerians in sympathizing with various victims and their families and friends over what we are going through in the country. Indeed the country is going through a trying moment in terms of security because we are having security challenges in many states. It is no longer restricted to the North-East, North-West, North Central or even the South-East or South-West. We are now beginning to have challenges across the country, so we have to sympathize first with Mr. President, our security agencies and then the various victims. Now, coming back to your question on what you said about the NSA, it is not just today.

The NSA and Mr. President and security agencies and the governors have been having several meetings. So, the outcome of his statement is in line with most of the recommendations and suggestions we all put forward during those meetings. And so if he tells you that there is going to be decisive action, it is cumulative of all the decisions taken at various meetings. And I have no doubt in my mind that decisive actions are being taken.

What do you think of those who have doubted the capacity of the federal government under President Muhammadu Buhari in handling the situation?

In a democracy, people have the right to think the way they want. To be fair to President Muhammadu Buhari, you have to look at the security situation when he came to power in 2015 and try to compare it to what is happening today. You will remember that in 2015, most of these security challenges were restricted to the northern part of the country and predominantly in the north eastern part of the country,where most of the local government areas in states like Borno were occupied by Boko Haram. It was only five local government areas that were in the control of the government when he came in.

Now what action has been taken; have we been successful in that process? What was the situation that warranted declaration of emergency in three states of Yobe, Adamawa and Borno at the time? All that is now gone. Unfortunately most of these bandits escaped to other places. We are also having different kinds of challenges because we had the #EndSARS. After the protests, what is now happening, we have the Indigenous People of Biafra (IPOB). So, we have to look at the background of the challenges we are facing and the action that is being taken every day. Banditry has become so common.

Kidnapping has become so common but we are taking actions one after another. So, for people who are saying that the administration of President Buhari does not have the capacity, it is just in their imagination and opinion. In reality, actions are being taken and the security agencies are doing everything possible and I’m telling you as somebody who understands what is going on and what we go through every day, to say there is no capacity is a very unfair statement.

Are the activities of the government and the results commensurate and justifiable in the eyes of an average Nigerian?

What an average Nigerian needs to understand is what they are seeing on a daily basis and the challenges we are facing every day in the various states and the way they are being handled. In most of these kidnappings that you have seen, the security agencies mount a lot of pressure on most cases, they get them released. In some cases, it takes a little bit longer.

I think there are two different approaches that people are talking about. A lot of people keep saying that we need outside support. Having outside support doesn’t necessarily mean that we don’t have the capacity. In most of the wars that have fought in the world, you will see a lot of countries actually asking for foreign support. Now, if you look at capacity, how many people do we have in the various agencies? Take the police, for instance, one of the states that used to have over 40,000 policemen, today it has about 25 to 30 per cent of that.

We have less number and so if that is the kind of capacity you are talking about, well Mr. President has given the go-ahead to make sure that they engage more people and more personnel. If you talk about the equipment, you don’t just get some of this equipment over the shelf because you have to place orders and orders have been placed and some of the equipment are coming. So, if you say capacity, the question is: Capacity in what aspect? Even if you bring somebody else to come from outside, he has to understand your environment.

We have our personnel that actually understand our environment and they are doing the best they can. Questioning of the capacity of the President may be based on the promises made during the campaigns and when the party was seeking power; what they said they will do and what we are seeing right now. Is the government living up to the promises it made? When the government was coming in, the major problem we had on insecurity in the country was Boko Haram. Boko Haram has been technically been defeated. Just as I told you that if you look at what is happening today in Borno State, you will discover that most of those local government areas that have been taken over by Boko Haram have not been taking over by the government. When the government was coming in the only insecurity was about that and there was no question of the IPOB, there was no question of the #End- SARS, there was no question of kidnapping on the highways on a daily basis and so all those things were not there. These are new things that are coming.

How did the government allow all of these things to degenerate into this point?

The government did not allow anything to degenerate. For instance, take the issue of banditry we have today in Nasarawa State; most of those bandits that were dislodged from places like Borno and Yobe states, a lot of them actually find their way to a place like Nasarawa today. Again, all the security agencies have a joint operation of the Air Force, Police, Department State of Services (DSS) and the Navy attacked them and they killed many of them. And many others ran away and we took hostage of many members of their families. So, problems are coming one after another and the government will not necessarily on its own just say insecurity should come. So, the various cases of insecurity are issues that are coming, is it the government that asked the #EndSARS campaigners to start their protest. I think these are the issues people should look at.

There have been series of meetings you have recently been part of and one would imagine that mostly these meetings are on how to resolve the insecurity situation in the country. For you, what has come out of these meetings as a possible concrete solution to these problems?

Well, that is why from the beginning I answered that some of the statements made by the NSA are actually cumulatively based on different kinds of the meeting we have had. In a lot of these meetings, we made our own recommendation and suggestions. We were also asked to go back to our various states and see what we can do, and it requires planning. Security issues are about planning. So, they have been planning and they are putting things forward. We are coming in and we are taking actions one at a time. And that is what you will see. Note that when you have a meeting today, they are going to be operational tomorrow. But it requires some planning and the planning is what is happening. And that is why the NSA made that decisive decision.

The governor of Rivers State said the nation is on life support, do you agree with that sort of description of our situation?

Absolutely not because if it is on life support, even himself as a governor, would not be sitting there in Port Harcourt. He would be out of Port Harcourt by now. Let me tell you; there are times when situations are serious but definitely not about politics. People are going to work, yes we are having security challenges in the country but it is not that we never had this kind of situation before. For some of us spend all our lives working all over the country. I used to fly from Lagos to Kano and the whole of Kano between 2014 and 2015 was filled with police and soldiers at every point and corner because Boko Haram was inside every city and they were bombing. The country was not in life support then and it is definitely not in life support today. Are we having security challenges today? Yes! Are they many? Yes! Are they multiple? Yes, and we are having them everywhere. Is the government doing something? Yes! The government is working on that every time of the day. So, I think to say that the country is on life support is more political than anything because if it is on life support we would not be having this programme that we are having today. What is the meaning of life support? Life support means that you can’t do anything for yourself. The bandits will not be hiding and carrying out these guerilla attacks. They will not be kidnapping and running into the bush. They will do it at will and stay inside the town. That is life support. So, I think the meaning of life support may be different based on his terminology but definitely, Nigeria is not on life support.

Would you advocate for the employment of mercenaries either in the North-East or North-West?

When you say hiring mercenaries, it is quite different. You see, from the beginning, the day I visited Maiduguri and returned, I was one of those who said we need foreign support. But you see, I have never been in the military, the police or any security agency. So, I don’t know the parameters about hiring all these people that you are talking about. All I want as a governor is peace and whatever that will bring that peace I will gladly accept. If it is the mercenaries are going to come and bring please, bring them because I’m not going to play politics about that. Did we have mercenaries before 2015 or so, yes we did. Was the problem solved; definitely not. So, I think if there is anybody who understands the situation, he should be President Buhari who was a major general and who has been in the military. So, I don’t play politics with that aspect. Do we need foreign support? I honestly think we do because in terms of personnel, we don’t have enough yet. We are just in the process of engaging and recruiting them. On equipment, I don’t believe we have enough yet and that is what the governors are saying every day. So I think we need to do that in order to be able to take these people up but this kind of war we are going through, I think Afghanistan has been going through it for over 30 years because these is not a conventional war.

What sort of foreign help do you think Nigeria needs, and which countries would you suggest for the government?

We need foreign technology. We need to have some kind of equipment that would be able to run into these bandits since they are staying in the bushes. We need to have that so that we can attack them and I think so many countries have this kind of technology. Definitely, the United State (U.S.) is the country that understands more than any other and since the U.S. has it, we can go for it. Again we have always been part of Britain and this is the time for Britain to help us with equipment, technology, personnel and training that we require. We require a lot of training and personnel would have to come and train our people. Definitely that is the kind of foreign help we need.

Do you agree that insecurity crisis in the country was instigated by politicians?

There are lots of theories about this. For me, like I said in Nasarawa State, I don’t want to even pay attention to that. A lot of people mention all kinds of them but I don’t have any prove because nobody has been able to say this is a particular politician, who is doing it. But it is being said and people even those at the highest level believe that most likely these things are being instigated by politicians. It is the same thing that was said when Goodluck Jonathan was in power. They said Boko Haram is being instigated by politicians. They said IPOB is being instigated by politicians but who is IPOB attacking; the same Igbo people. If they want to save the Igbo people, why are they attacking them?

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